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Should we have a draft - take 2

2K views 88 replies 22 participants last post by  runbill 
#1 ·
Still thinking about the earlier thread where most of the comments were anti-draft. I was reading an article about a kid who wouldn't say the pledge of Allegiance. If you are against the draft, what does the Pledge mean to you? Do you support the kid's right not to say the Pledge? If you are pro pledge and anti draft, how do those positions square? Is it just important to do symbolic things for your country?
 
#3 ·
You can't have these things both ways. Either we are free to think, speak and do as we please (with reasonable exceptions) or we are not. Part of the freedom this country was built on dictates that if we want to call the POTUS a dumbass, sit down during the national anthem, burn the flag or not say the pledge of allegiance we are allowed to do so. We have never legislated class, respect or intelligence and we shouldn't try.
 
#6 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>muzicgrl</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717272"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Nothing wrong with refusing to say the pledge.<br><br>
Generally it has nothing to do with allegiance to the country and everything to do with "God" being included anyway.</div>
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isn't there a "godless" pledge of alleigance?
 
#7 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Mrtambalynman</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717274"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">isn't there a "godless" pledge of alleigance?</div>
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yeah, perhaps saying the pledge and keeping your teeth shut when you get to the "under god" part
 
#9 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Mrtambalynman</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717274"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">isn't there a "godless" pledge of alleigance?</div>
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Nope...unless we are talking about a country other than the US.<br><br>
Plus I dont really think it matters anyway. Why should we have to pledge allegiance to a country anyway?
 
#10 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>muzicgrl</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717281"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Nope...unless we are talking about a country other than the US.<br><br>
Plus I dont really think it matters anyway. Why should we have to pledge allegiance to a country anyway?</div>
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I pledged alleigance to a Queen......who lives in another country.....to work as a civil servant.....<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.kickrunners.com/forum/images/smilies/biggrin.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Very Happy"><br><br>
I think its a holdover from the time when a person's word was their bond.
 
#11 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Mrtambalynman</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717286"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I think its a holdover from the time when a <span style="text-decoration:underline;">person's word was their bond</span>.</div>
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I know, passe and all but there are some that still believe this
 
#12 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>mrscoby78</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717278"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I haven't said it in a bajillion years, but I have said "One nation...indivisible...with liberty and justice for all"</div>
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Were you born in the 40's? The "under God" part wasn't added until...<i>check Wikipedia</i>...1954.
 
#13 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>gumbee</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717295"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">I know, passe and all but there are some that still believe this</div>
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Ya, but I think the key word in your post is some. There was a time when the President would have said this and the electorate would have had a reasonable expectation that the President would have lived up to this commitment.
 
#14 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>purple hayes</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717299"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Were you born in the 40's? The "under God" part wasn't added until...<i>check Wikipedia</i>...1954.</div>
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No. I'm just a firm believer in the separation of church & state. My allegiance to my country has absolutely nothing to do with belief in any god.
 
#15 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>runbill</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717255"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Still thinking about the earlier thread where most of the comments were anti-draft. I was reading an article about a kid who wouldn't say the pledge of Allegiance. If you are against the draft, what does the Pledge mean to you? Do you support the kid's right not to say the Pledge? If you are pro pledge and anti draft, how do those positions square? Is it just important to do symbolic things for your country?</div>
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Being an American I'm thrilled to death to be here. Ain't no way in hell a pledge of allegiance makes a dent. I'll scream it if I need to. Anyone having a hard time with it needs to spend a few months someplace else. This silly bullshit about..."it has God in it"...big fucking deal! How many churchs are in the USA?
 
#16 ·
I don't think there should be a draft.<br><br>
I don't care if anyone decides not to say the pledge of allegance.<br><br>
In the case of elected officials, it's true that saying the pledge of allegance takes on a greater importance, but the reality is their actions are the true indicator of their allegance, not them repeating words while hamming for the camera.
 
#18 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>mrscoby78</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717315"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">No. I'm just a firm believer in the separation of church & state. My allegiance to my country has absolutely nothing to do with belief in any god.</div>
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yeabut why do you always say "<i>OH GOD OH GOD OH GOD..."</i><br><br>
heheheheh I'm kidding it's more like - "OH JENNA OH JENNA..." LOL
 
#19 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Mrtambalynman</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717327"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">the pledge of allegiance probably is about as effective as virginity pledges.</div>
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You can do anal and still be a virgin right?
 
#20 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>OakDawg</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717329"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">You can do anal and still be a virgin right?</div>
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That's what 'taggie told music.
 
#21 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>mrscoby78</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717315"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">No. I'm just a firm believer in the separation of church & state. My allegiance to my country has absolutely nothing to do with belief in any god.</div>
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Me too, except my allegiance to God is greater than that of any state/country.
 
#22 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>Mrtambalynman</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717274"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">isn't there a "godless" pledge of alleigance?</div>
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Circa 1923:<br><br><i>"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."</i>
 
#23 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>OakDawg</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717265"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">...Either we are free to think, speak and do as we please (with reasonable exceptions)...</div>
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hehe...
 
#24 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>muzicgrl</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717272"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Generally it has nothing to do with allegiance to the country and everything to do with "God" being included anyway.</div>
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They're both borne of the same impulse.
 
#25 ·
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<div>Originally Posted by <strong>muzicgrl</strong> <a href="/forum/post/1717281"><img alt="View Post" class="inlineimg" src="/img/forum/go_quote.gif" style="border:0px solid;"></a></div>
<div style="font-style:italic;">Why should we have to pledge allegiance to a country anyway?</div>
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"I pledge allegiance to the flag ...."<br><br>
We're really saying that we will be loyal to a flag, in essence to a strip of cloth bearing a particular pattern. Any allegiance to the country is almost like an after-thought: "... and to the country ...."<br><br>
We are apparently one of a handful of countries that makes our pledge to the flag, and that lifts it to an artificially elevated status. And that, in turn, leads to misguided efforts to make burning the flag the subject of a constitutional amendment. Quite frankly, if it comes to a choice between my country and my flag, the flag's going to lose. I believe that the country is strong enough to handle a few flag burnings here and there.
 
#26 ·
I must have missed the first thread on this.<br><br>
No draft. If you don't want to serve, I don't want you in my Army. I certainly don't want you watching my back in Afghanistan.<br><br>
We struggled when the economy was good and the war in Iraq was at its worst. But we made it. We don't need a bunch of<br><br>
(rant deleted.)
 
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