[leanmattie]

(it's not my favorite term for the subject, but oh well...)<br><br>
From what I can tell, in 1976, NASA released a study that concluded that Mars could sustain life (if we chose to insert it...the question of whether or not any primitive life is still somewhat open) and ultimately be made into a habitable planet. We have a GREAT deal of bots currently on or orbiting Mars studying the planet. This is not science fiction and it's not fantastical, it's real.<br><br>
How do you feel about planetrary engineering other planets. Or terraforming, or planetary ecosynthesis?<br><br>
Personally, having a background in biology and ecology, I am somewhat uncomfortable with tinkering with natural processes willy nilly, but I find the prospect of jump starting another planet rather exciting.<br><br>
Grizz jumpstarted a fascination iwith astronomy in me a few months back with a fairly innocuous statement about distant stars. Here I am a few months later, TOTALLY captivated with the subject. That is a good thing. <img alt="blush.gif" src="http://files.kickrunners.com/smilies/blush.gif"><br><br><br>
With Respect,<br><br>
mattie

 

[ecodork]

The idea kind of freaks me out, mostly because, like with many things we do here on earth, we don't understand the consequences of our actions. But that's never seemed to stop humans from doing things before. But I agree, it is fascinating. I just don't know if I want to be involved. <img alt="biggrin.gif" src="http://files.kickrunners.com/smilies/biggrin.gif"><br><br>
On a side note, I have a friend who is working on a method for recycling human waste in a small space, with the application being how this would be handle when humans are sent to Mars. I think it's estimated that the journey would take about 6 months or so. That would be a lot of waste...

 

[Grizzly]

Well, we could "terraform" Mars, but it would be incredibly expensive and require an inordinate amount of time, and in the end it would be futile for the same reasons that have made Mars a barren (perhaps not life-less) world.<br><br>
The atmosphere would be bled off by the solar wind. There is a negligible to non-existant magnetic field, and so the solar radiation at all spectrums makes it to the surface, the atmosphere would always be thin, Mars' gravity would not support something thick enough unless there was a run-away greenhouse effect.<br><br>
Have you read the Red/Green/Blue Mars books? There's also the question of whether we have the right to tamper with another eco-system. Dunno.<br><br>
Still and all, it's fun to dream ain't it?<br><br>
Want something really funky? What about blocking all sunlight from hitting Venus by installing a big solar sail at a Venutial Lagrange point and freezing out the atmosphere, starting again from scratch?

 

[RandMart]

What? Like strip-mining? Slash & burn farming? New Jersey?

 

[leanmattie]

An inordinate amount of time...yes. I'm not really thinking about it's habitability in the next millenium or so, but much beyond that. Expense? Well, we are sending landers there fairly regularly. If they were to just seed the planet, well, I think that would be very interesting.<br><br>
I don't like the idea at all of tinkering with existing ecosystems. Not at all. But if you take a lifeless planet, and insert life? Well, that intrigues me.<br><br>
Granted, Mars is not currently well suited for life (to say the least), not is it going to be in a long, long time. I think that fact does not erase the debate. Or not in my mind.<br><br>
I actually think Earth might benefit from knowing that in 2000 years (T-O-T-A-L-L-Y unrealistic number currently), another planet might be habitable. OK, we just have to hold our sh|t together for another 2000 years. OK, we just have to hold our sh|t together for another 1990 years. OK, we just have to hold our sh|t together for another 1500 years. And so on...<br><br><br><br>
With Respect,<br><br>
mattie

 

[leanmattie]

Grizz...does a lifeless planet constitute an ecosystem? I dunno.<br><br>
Granted, I don't think we have concluded 100% that Mars is CURRENTLY lifeless (in terms of probiotic life), but assuming that were so.<br><br>
For my part, reading about the conditions and atmospheres of some of the other planets and moons around those planets, I suspect that there IS some form of VERY primitive life out there in our solar system. I mean, we have Monera that live in lava. If some form of life isn't in our solar system, I feel confident that we COULD insert it. The debate about whether we should or not is totally legit....so shouldn't we start that debate? <img alt="smile.gif" src="http://files.kickrunners.com/smilies/smile.gif"><br><br><br>
With Respect,<br><br>
mattie

 

[leanmattie]

One last thing....<br><br>
I could imagine that TRYING to engineer things such that life existed and/or was more favorable on another planet could teach us a tremendous amount about how to take care of our own planet.<br><br><br>
With Respect,<br><br>
mattie

 

[Grizzly]

IIRC there are a few arguments. The one I am leaning towards is ensuring that we're not going to kill any indigenous life forms in our quest to terraform. There's another that is more aesthetic - leaving it the way we found it - untouched.

 

[leanmattie]

I can definitely respect that. I get excited about the "possibilities", but if we were to learn from our history, that might arguably be the best way to go...<br><br><br><br>
With respect,<br><br>
mattie

 

[HighHeat]

If there was water and some form of relatively rampant microscopic life there <i>at some point</i> in the past, wouldn't that mean there was oil there, too?<br><br>
What sort of implications would that have on the politics of inhabiting the place?...

 

[RunsTheBitterroot]

If there is something to exploit, we will be there. The whole idea of planetary engineering, travel and expansion into other worlds, is exciting. Larry

 

[Billy]

For what it may be worth, I really enjoyed Kim Stanley Robinson's Mars trilogy (Red Mars, Green Mars, Blue Mars). The science is now a little dated, now that a few more probes have sent back data in the early 2000s. I like the way he talks through terraforming (areoformation on Mars) in terms of technology, politics, and even religion.

 

[refinnej10]

I also think it's an interesting idea, but...<br><br>
I don't feel good about the fact that we'd be terraforming mars because we wasted all the natural resources here and basically trashed the place. That makes it feel a little too self serving to really be noble.<br><br>
Second, we're so (unfortunately) ignorant about how life gets started and how planets age and whatnot, that we're undoubtedly going to do harm (unintended as it may be). We can't even figure out how to "maintain" a forest on earth that we can see, touch, feel, monitor, etc. How am I supposed to believe that we're capable of creating and then maintaining an environment on Mars?<br><br>
What if life is evolving on Mars differently than it did on earth? What if it's a completely different atom based life form? What if we find out too late that it's there?<br><br>
What gives us the right to use this planet to suit our own purposes?

 

[rnrlowe]



<br><br>
Would we really be "jumpstarting" another planet or just "infecting" another environment? I guess it's all in how one looks at it.

 

[Ileneforward]

I think we should put that engineering know-how to keeping our planet habitable. Reverse global warming, grow crops in the Mojave desert, clean up the air pollution in Beijing and elsewhere.

 

["Roberto"]

Total Recall!<br><br><img alt="" src="http://www.britfilms.tv/images/news/total%20recall.gif" style="border:0px solid;">

 

[tigger]

FWIW, we've been ecoforming Earth since we evolved from the apes. Any visitation to another location in the galaxy would require some sort of ecoforming simply to enable us to survive. It is likely that no place could be ecoformed to make it resemble earth, at least not in a relatively short period of time. By the time we acquire the ability to do that much work we'll have gotten so lazy that we'll not want to do it.

 

[purple hayes]

I'm all for moving to another planet with more daylight and less winter.

 

[Ileneforward]

Venus!!

 

[refinnej10]

Warm, yes. But never sunny. <img alt="sad.gif" src="http://files.kickrunners.com/smilies/sad.gif">