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Discussion Starter #1
For this discussion, I categorize tempo (naer LT) and intervals as speed workout.<br><br>
I do only one speed work per week during a marathon training per the Pftizinger's schedule, except during a week which includes a short interval and a tune-up race. At the early stage, it is a tempo (upto 7 miles) then 1000~1600m interval. It works for my body. I don't think I can handle tempo and interval week after week. Now, for a triathlon training, how many speed work do you do per week? One for each sport? Do you do it alternatively (i.e. this week is run speed work and next week is bike, swim long tempo doesn't take too much out of you, I think).<br><br>
With my training peaking heading to HIM in 3 weeks, I did a swim tempo (1mile OW race) Wed, a run interval (1600x3 inserted in 8 mile) Wed., bike interval (5min/3min rest x 6) on Fri, then bike tempo (40min, inserted into 40miles total) today. Of course, a long run of 11.6mile had to be done yesterday. so that is a total of four speedworks within 5 days. I guess this explaines why my body is fried. I could have spread these workouts better, but you know life always gets in the way....<br><br>
Thanks!
 

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HOnestly.....<br>
I've tried to figure out the rhyme and reason behind some of CS's schedules, and I can't.....except it's generally 2 hard 1 recovery by week. Within the week, though..... I haven't got a clue.<br><br>
I know what the runs look like...<br>
and the bikes....<br>
and Ann gives me my swims....<br>
but as an overall plan..... clueless.<br>
I just try to follow directions and schedule my life accordingly. Sometimes, I'm better at this than others.
 

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Hell Tuesday=bike speed/HR/power workout<br>
Hell Wed=Speedwork in Pool<br>
Hell Thursday=running speedwork
 

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During build cycles which I do 2 hard, 1 recovery, I usually do one speed session in each discipline. During base, I stick to mostly fartleks and hilly runs, longer swim sets with some fast sets at the end 1X/week, and one bike interval session.
 

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Wow Yoshiko that seems like a lot! I think normally there should be more days between speed sessions but I am not sure. I would consider that your final push in training for SH. I bet you are tired!
 

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As long as next week is recovery, that sounds good - but very tough. Now, it doesn't seem to make as much sense if next week isn't recovery. Or at least no hard speedwork next week.<br><br>
I've still got speed work next week, but I'm all screwed up cuz I was on forced recovery week this week - which was not on the original plan - because I was falling apart.<br><br>
So I guess my "point" if in fact I have one, is that next week needs to be a significant reduction.
 

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Yo Sake,<br><br>
I too have had success using Pfitz training plans and will still use them for marathoning, so I can understand his approach to training. (He's got the second edition coming out in December!!!)<br><br>
My prior HIM training close to race date (using a 26 week schedule) had me starting bike tempo rides on Wednesday one day a week, swimming speedwork one day a week about 5~6 weeks out, and running tempo pacing one day a week about 4 weeks out. The distances or times were not excessive, generally less than an hour, with a recovery day or E2 hr zone day on either side of the hard effort day, then taper weeks and race week.<br><br>
Good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Sounds like 4 was too much, but 3 (1 per descipline) seems to be a good rule of thumb.<br><br>
Ron - no, the next week is not recovery, with taper #1 starting a following week. Depending upon how my body recovers from this week, I was thinking to do one more bike interval and short run interval (like 800x). Then I have a sprint race next Sunday to wrap up my peak (intensity-wise). Yeah, all out effort.
 

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Focus on your recovery. You should be fried end of NEXT week, not this week. So maybe take it easy a day or two to catch up before you hit the next set of speed stuff?<br><br>
I'm doing an Aquabike as my warmup race and looking forward to letting loose on it <img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.kickrunners.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Smile">
 

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Stitch...if you're trying to figure out rhyme & reason to Sheldon's schedules...ASK HIM<img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.kickrunners.com/forum/images/smilies/surprised.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Surprised"><br><br>
I do. I'm a WHY girl...I just wanna know why.
 

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I think it's a little heavy from your past experiences, but you'll live if its just for a week.<br><br>
As soon as you start going anaerobic, especially if the workouts are hard enough to push you close to failure, then you will have to cut way back.<br><br>
If you are in good shape, the tempo on the bike won't kill you, but it comes down to what your body will tolerate at this point in the cycle.<br><br>
Just one solid one a week from here on in, snappy riding with full recovery and all the warmup and cooldown is at controlled pace.<br><br>
Don't overdo in the week prior to tapering and underdo in the tapering period, keep your body working but reduce the volume and sharpen up your mind.
 

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Welllllllllllllllll<br><br>
I'd ask him,.....but he's cranky these days...<br>
something about a 'puter crashing again. yikes!!!<br><br><img alt="" class="inlineimg" src="http://www.kickrunners.com/forum/images/smilies/smile.gif" style="border:0px solid;" title="Smile"><br><br>
I know enough for right now, and sorta dig trying to figure things out....but, eventually will ask when I get too confused.<br><br>
I don't tend to ask Ann either,....except once in awhile, the "point" to workouts. I can sometimes figure it out from the sets she writes.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I am confused. 5min/3min x 6 type of training, I thought, was supposed to be done at above LT, which I thought means anaerobic. I was under the assumption that this type of workout is an equivalent of run interval like 1000x5, 1200x4, 1600x3, etc, which is done above LT for sure and some calls 'vo2 max run'. So I am sure I go anaerobic - heck, I thought I needed to be anaerobic to benefit from this type of training. At least for running, I believe that is the case. Different for biking? Tempo is a different story, I know. Thanks for clarification.
 

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Not all speedwork is anaerobic. When doing intervals, you may go anaerobic for a short time, then you have a recovery that brings your HR back down, so you really aren't anaerobic for very long (if any). It depends on your purpose for the workout. Tempo workouts also are not necessarily anaerobic.
 

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Sure, but if you look at the total volume of "work" it's a lot less for the workout and for the week as a whole (or it should be) because you are placing an added strain on your body with these type of intervals. Your body will come around with this added stress but it's best to make sure the total weekly hours have dropped, especially when you introduce this.<br><br>
Usually, the tempo work is part of basebuilding and continues into the later spring, but because you run a spring marathon, your "winter" training has to start in May and is more compressed.
 

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There's AT and threshold training. Not the same.<br><br>
AT training is where you go max out and is anaerobic. Z5 training (86%+ max or "above LT"<img alt="wink.gif" src="http://files.kickrunners.com/smilies/wink.gif">. Very short - no choice, you cannot hold it long - by definition. Like 4 minutes. This is what you probably think about when you think about intervals in running. Extremely stressful to your system. Cannot be mixed with long stuff.<br><br>
Threshold training is where you are at Z4 (80-85% max) and is longer durations, more repeats. This is just at LT - right below it. Longer intervals. Again stressful, just not nearly as bad.<br><br>
Remember, you have a much stronger running system than cycling. I do not think you should be doing nearly as much Z5 stuff on the bike as you do on the run and for sure not a combo of each or you're going to really tax yourself.
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Thanks, jr, for a clarification. I somewhat misunderstood your original post. Right, I am not staying 'anaerobic' long, and each interval is short and I do cut way back for a recovery.
 

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When I do my 5 minute intervals in the winter, they are supposed to be just below the point where I accumulate more LA than I can metabolise, but sometimes I throw a little too much on the fire. I can really feel the reaction in my body when I'm done and feel a little more sore and draggy the next day. It's not a huge deal and when the time comes I'm not shy about revving right into that system until it fails, but the intensity of tempo type work is more nagging and cumulative (tour de france riders are rolling off many hours at tempo for weeks) while the spikes into the anaerobic zone are what can contribute to burnout if you don't time them right and have a good plan.<br><br>
People toss aroun the notion of "burnout" a lot but use it in such a generalised way it has no meaning. If all you do is 10 mos of year of overdistance, I'd be inclined to vomit just thinking about more steady pace grinding toward the horizon too, but that's more physical and mental exhaustion, where too much anaerobic work will cause super performance, followed by lousy weak performance, which is what I think of as burnout, the period following supercompensation.
 
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