Power Tracking Thread - KickRunners.com
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#1 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 10:33 AM - Thead Starter
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Sounds like there are several of us looking to make a significant boost during our winter riding.

Anyone want to start tracking progress via a thread?

Just a thought... I need to do a FT test, all I know is intervals I was dying on at 200-225 I'm not easily doing at 285. So I'm thinking I improved year to year. I'd like to see some substantial gains again, but not even sure what's realistic.

Also, from the other thread (low rpm) I wonder what my power/kg numbers will look like. Being a big guy, 325watts won't propel me nearly as quickly as it would Jroden or Thor. So I need to exceed you bad boys so someday I can grow up and be as fast as you
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#2 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 10:37 AM
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I'd like to look at ftp as w/ kg and perhaps look at the impact on that plus this "TSS" value people seem to talk about a lot. I'm still getting my head around what I want to do this winter, I feel a little paralyzed by owning this computrainer and associated software, there's a lot more to fiddle with than my old tacx.

The good news is you can sell them used and get back most of your money.
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#3 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 12:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jroden View Post
The good news is you can sell them used and get back most of your money.
But if you want to sell your old Tacx for low cash, I'd take it!

Good thread.

So what would make a good yardstick test as baselining your efforts and being able to gauge them?

Jr proposed recording Power output over efforts of 40 seconds, 5 minutes, and 20 minutes. Perhaps do that once per month.

Any other ideas?

Usually I just go with my overall workout average wattage, which isn't that bad a yardstick because, well, I try to take advantage of the "Always On" of the Trainer. Had I not, then this would be a poor gauge due to all the down time.
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#4 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 01:07 PM
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Anyone have a dictionary for all these TLAs?
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#5 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 01:20 PM
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Well to calculate your FTP, you do a 20 minute average then subtract 5%. I think the FTP is more relevant to those of us doing HIMs and IMs. The reason you subtract 5% is that this is supposed to give you an approximate of what your threshold power for an hour.

I would do an FTP test in December, I haven't done one since last winter. Take this and divide by your weight in kg to get watts/kg. There is a table in which you can create a power profile from Andrew Coggan. You can create a power profile for FTP, 1 min, 5min, etc. He has a classification on where you rank based on your watts/kg.

Not to say what he has done is the end all, but the guy has done a lot of testing of athletes, including some top pro cyclists. So its probably a good approximation of where you might rank among others.

Though I have to say I wasn't too thrilled with my numbers the first time, I tested like a newb.
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#6 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 01:33 PM
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ouch, no fun.

I did the 15 secs from a standing start, which I think did not give me very good results, so I'm tossing that for now

5mp is at 4.4 w/kg
20mp is 3.6 w/kg, which I'm going to assume is about my ftp as I had done the prior test. At my 82 kg, that's right around 300 watts for a 10 mile tt.

So, not the greatest news, but after 3 mos off the bike what have I to expect. Time to get to work.
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#7 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 01:35 PM
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I'm in. Next weekend I'll do my TTT (trainer time trial). Should theoretically take me about 26 minutes to make my computer think I've travelled 10 miles, it will be interesting to see the actual number. And that should be close enough to 20 minutes to calculate my FTP.

Anyone care to hazard a guess? In my summer time trials (10 miles, flat) I could average 23 mph.

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#8 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 01:44 PM
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you can back figure it using analytic cycling website. at 82 kg my 300 watts should have put me down the road in the mid 24 mph range, but you at 20 lbs less would have needed i dunno 270 to ride next to me
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#9 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 02:18 PM
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I'll report back Saturday or next week. I'll do a 5min and 20min
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#10 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by niemsco View Post
I'll report back Saturday or next week. I'll do a 5min and 20min
I'll report back in... umm... December. I'm avoiding the Trainer until then, because when I hit that puppy, after a two or three weeks of getting back into the grind and the muscles reconditioned, the real work will start. So I'm in no rush. But I'd love to compare number here. My problem is that my power meter, I'm convinced, is off. It is repeatable. But I don't think the number itself is accurate. So I'm not sure what kind of comparison it would be.
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#11 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 03:50 PM
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My problem is that my power meter, I'm convinced, is off. It is repeatable. But I don't think the number itself is accurate. So I'm not sure what kind of comparison it would be.
Track your speed with your bike computer instead. Oh wait...that's on the fritz, too.

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#12 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 04:34 PM
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This may be useful for reference. Watts/kg chart:



Just don't be discouraged if you are Fair or Moderate. This is one person's interpretation, Andrew Coggan who wrote the "Training and Racing with a Power Meter" book. Though he seems to know a heck of a lot, and tested lots of people. This was published in 2006. I think I tested Fair the first time and I wasn't all that slow. The top is like Lance Armstrong good...
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#13 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 05:05 PM
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The 20min FTP test minus 5% = the FT column in the chart above?
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#14 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 05:07 PM
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Awesome post, Niemsco!

Quote:
Originally Posted by MBannon View Post
Track your speed with your bike computer instead. Oh wait...that's on the fritz, too.
Funny. Because here I sit, thinking I will someday SOON buy myself a Garmin Edge 305... but because speed is GPS-calculated in the unit, I can't even use THAT.
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#15 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 05:47 PM
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Awesome post, Niemsco!


Funny. Because here I sit, thinking I will someday SOON buy myself a Garmin Edge 305... but because speed is GPS-calculated in the unit, I can't even use THAT.
You can with the cadence sensor. At least it works for me with my 405. When you turn the GPS off, the cadence sensor also acts as a speed sensor. I have to assume 305 has a similar feature.
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#16 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 06:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by niemsco View Post
You can with the cadence sensor. At least it works for me with my 405. When you turn the GPS off, the cadence sensor also acts as a speed sensor. I have to assume 305 has a similar feature.
Thank you. All the more reason to pick up one of these NOW. Thank you, thank you! Because now that you mention it, I think you're right!
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#17 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 06:59 PM
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Quote:
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The 20min FTP test
I'm showing my lack of understanding here ...

What is a 20 minute FTP test?
How does one do it?
What do the results mean?

Thanks.
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#18 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 07:32 PM
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What is a 20 minute FTP test?
How does one do it?
What do the results mean?
http://www.trainingpeaks.com/hunter/whatisthreshold.asp

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#19 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 08:34 PM
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Those of us without power meters are stuck.
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#20 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 08:42 PM
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Those of us without power meters are stuck.
I do not have a power meter. But the Kurt Kinetic website gives me a formula to convert speed on their trainer into approximate wattage (+/- 3% according to them). What kind of trainer do you use?

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#21 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 08:45 PM
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At what resistance do I need to set my Tacx? I mean, how would I make my numbers comparable to the others doing the tests if we are all set at different resistances? Or does that even matter?
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#22 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 09:06 PM
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At what resistance do I need to set my Tacx? I mean, how would I make my numbers comparable to the others doing the tests if we are all set at different resistances? Or does that even matter?
which tacx, do you plug it in the wall?

To compare power, you need to measure it with a trainer designed to do so or a device on your bike. You can use speed as a relative proxy is your tire pressure is the same, but it is just for your comparison week over week, not a value with any external meaning.
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#23 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 09:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jroden View Post
which tacx, do you plug it in the wall?

To compare power, you need to measure it with a trainer designed to do so or a device on your bike. You can use speed as a relative proxy is your tire pressure is the same, but it is just for your comparison week over week, not a value with any external meaning.

Tacx Cycleforce flow. Yes, it plugs in. I've lost the directions, not that they were usful anyway, so I'll have to work with it a bit.
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#24 of 402 Old 11-13-2008, 09:57 PM
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Tacx Cycleforce flow. Yes, it plugs in. I've lost the directions, not that they were useful anyway, so I'll have to work with it a bit.
I used the flow for a long time, you can do a 20 minute test by warming up the tire for 20 mins, calibrating the unit to zero (important to do) then use the slop mode set on say +1 or so and do a 20 minute time trial, make sure you reset the average watts function.

The tacx is not altogether accurate, but it is better in the slope mode than in the ergo mode. If you buy the I-magic conversion and hook it to your computer, it is supposed to be pretty close even in ergo mode.

I used mine a lot in ergo mode for intervals, I just used a ramp test to determine my LT and figured that was close enough.

The tacx is a great tool for the money.
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#25 of 402 Old 11-14-2008, 08:28 AM - Thead Starter
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So @ 285watts (did for 10 min so I'll just toss it in for kicks to the 5 min chart) and at 107kg that means I'm "untrained". Man I suck!

- If you think you can't, you're right.
- Just because you can, doesn't mean you should.
- REJOICE and Whine not! For today you are doing that which most only dream.

 

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